Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

For Oblivion. And some other stuff, I suppose.
Post Reply
Message
Author
User avatar
Reyes
Rofficer
Posts: 3887
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2005 6:13 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#71 Post by Reyes » Fri Feb 09, 2018 1:29 pm

Did some farming and quick quests last night in between episodes of Dark. My defence was about 145 before, should be about 170 once I finish my wishlist. I was annoyed about the number of Frost Sacs I needed for my ice weapon, but then my Tailrider Safari came back with 3 of them. I accepted some random people's guild cards and now the safari is rated 5* in everything

The event quest with Odogaron and Radobaan together in the arena seems like it could be good to co-op
Image
"Now all we need is some mood music...like whale songs"

User avatar
Fienasre
Legend
Posts: 3466
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:32 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#72 Post by Fienasre » Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:42 am

The whole thing got under my skin. I didn't play much this weekend because I got pissed at the High Rank Anjanath. Though I did get my Swtich axe up to rarity 5 still with the exhaustion vial. Which is AMAZING because monsters get tired a lot quicker. I am still waiting for the hunter rank to unlock after finishing the assignments. Anyway, I captured the High Rank Anjanath in the wildspire wastes and unlocked the quest to hunt the next monster in the Coral Highlands. How far are you?
│o_

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#73 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:52 am

I don't know why but I was kind of expecting High Rank to be like some sort of difficulty switch. But it's really more of the same so far.

Have fought Pukei Pukei, The chicken, Barroth, Anjanath a couple of times, the Tsatsiki thing, Tobi Kadachi several times and what seemed like the biggest challenge was Pink Rathian. (I never did fight the original Rathian.) And the only thing that killed me out of those, was the electric squirrel.

I think I was a bit fortunate with Pink Rathian. It had 2 big fights vs Legiana. Which lasted ages. And I only had a rarity 4 weapon, which I picked for the dragon elemental damage. It took me 30 minutes to kill it.

Which me left wondering..

Rarity 5 weapon with basic 560 AP.

OR

Rarity4 weapon with 360 AP plus 330 elemental... damage? Whatever.

vs a monster with 3 star weakness to the correct element.

How the hell do you work out which is better? The 2nd one? At a guess?


Bezelgeuse is going to be a dick. He just 1 shot me coming out of the sky while I was fighting something else.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

User avatar
Reyes
Rofficer
Posts: 3887
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2005 6:13 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#74 Post by Reyes » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:55 pm

I made it to HR too, I have the Anjanath quest. He wrecked me in expedition mode when I was still using my low rank gear, but everything else has been ok. I was going for a capture on Jyuratodus. It was in skull mode, asleep, but I couldn't place a trap right on it because of the water, so I moved over to an island, put my trap down and fired my slinger to lure it over. It dives under the water and "Jyuratodus has left the locale".

It's kind of difficult to get a feel for the damage calculations in that you'll have like 340 AP but your attacks will be doing like 12 damage or whatever. I remember against Paolumu I didn't know what its resists were and switched weapons halfway through; I think I actually switched to a worse element, but it didn't really feel any different. But I think the elemental damage is actually like a proc which has a chance to go off on each hit? So it might depend on how fast your weapon is, but the base AP is probably going to be better
Image
"Now all we need is some mood music...like whale songs"

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#75 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:18 pm

I just lost my post. Argh.

It was all bullshit anyway.. Was trying and failing to understand damage numbers.

But something very general:

The number you see on the weapon can be divided by some arbitrary modifier that is different for each weapon type.

So my 560AP Long Sword is divided by 3.3 to get 170.

The lesser one gets 360 / 3.3 = 109.

And the elemental damage modifier is nothing to do with weapon type, it's a flat 10%.

So 170 beats (109 + 33).

But there's more to it than that, because elemental damage is not modifed by the Motion Value modifier of the specific attack (great big slow swings have a higher modifier than a small fast hit).

And there's even more than that, because the monster armour modifier has a huge impact on the final numbers.

But those last 2 statements both tend towards elemental damage being even weaker than I might have suggested.

because motion values seem to be extremely large (as a modifier) numbers. My crappest fastest swing has a motion value of 11. So the AP portion of the weapon is 11 times as strong as the elemental given everything would be equal? That makes no sense.

And it's even worse when you look at the monster armour rating. Best case, you hit something in the head with a slashing weapon and the modifier is 0.65. But for the elements, it's between 0.05 and 0.15.


In conclusion, I really don't understand it. Especially the motion value figures.* But what little I do understand, suggests that elemental damage is terrible.



* So I've seen some things that support what Reyes said, about elemental damage being better on faster weapons, because elemental damage doesn't factor in motion values.

But what makes no sense, are the numbers involved.

Because if it takes 1 second for an attack with a motion value modifier of 11, and 2 seconds for an attack with a motion value of 25. Those values crap all over the dual blades, despite how fast dual blades attack. You would need to attack 10 times in 1 second or 25 times in 2 seconds with the dual blades, just to match the motion value modifiers.

Dual Blades seem fast. But not that fast, surely.

But just to reiterate - I really don't understand it all.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#76 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:40 pm

Right, I think I might understand what's going wrong with what I wrote above.

The Motion Value examples - 11 and 25 for those 2 attack types. Those numbers are garbage. 11 and 25 are just the final end damage figures for those attacks with a naked character in the training room.

So you might actually have a damage value for your weapon of 100, and the motion value for attack A is 0.11 and the value for attack B is 0.25.

Those numbers are just shown to indicate how far away I might have been earlier. The actual motion value modifier figures are not known.

So far as I'm concerned, it is not possible to work out, what I want to work out.

Raw damage is lowered by the weapon raw damage modifier (1.2 for bows up to 5.2 for hammers) and those Motion Value modifiers that are surely fractions rather than whole numbers. Plus monster armour.

Elemental damage is lowered by the elemental damage modifier of 10%, and much higher values for monster armour.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#77 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:49 pm

I dunno again..

I've seen some attempts by people to calculate some Motion Value modifiers for some attacks and they seem to be numbers more in line with those 11s and 25s than with fractions.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#78 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:17 pm

Also the sharpness modifier is different for normal and elemental damage. But probably not worth worrying about here.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#79 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:50 pm

By the way, it seems as though Thunder and Dragon are between 1.3 to 4 times as effective as the other elements, depending on body part hit and which element. (That doesn't mean a Thunder Weapon is up to 4 times as good, but the elemental damage portion of the weapon can be.)

For Thunder and Dragon - Chest, Body, Tail => Head, Forelegs => Back Legs

For Fire and Water - Chest => Head, Forelegs => Body, Back Legs, Tail

For Ice - Chest => Everything else.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

User avatar
TroyBlade
Rofficer
Posts: 18828
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:34 pm

Re: Insert Tagline Here (the official Monster Hunter World thread)

#80 Post by TroyBlade » Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:57 pm

But how that translates into a 1* weakness to Thunder vs a 3* weakness to Fire - is anybody's guess..

Right, I'm going to stop going on about it now.

My final conclusion is that my gut feeling is that elemental damage is no match for raw attack power. But if the monster is weak to your element and/or your weapon is fast, it might be worth considering.

And my final final conclusion is that I cannot conclude anything at all with any certainty.
You killed John Wick's Dog's Human, and that human was John Wick.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest